LISA KNAPP’S INNOVATIVE DECONSTRUCTION OF TRADITIONAL FOLK MUSIC CONTINUES ON THE RECENTLY RELEASED HIDDEN SEAM.
It’s her first new album since 2007’s critically acclaimed (BBC Folk Award nominated) debut WILD AND UNDAUNTED – and, once again, she presents an inspirational tour-de-force of ambitious thinking and unconventional execution.
Motivated by a love of language (and “the sound of words, abstractly”), HIDDEN SEAM’s opening track is a romantic lilt through the strange place-names to be heard in the late night radio Shipping Forecast. Combining understated electronica, acoustic instruments, maritime sound effects and Lisa’s distinctive voice to spellbinding effect, SHIPPING SONG drifts out somewhere between the intimacy of Björk’s HEADPHONES (from POST) and the more esoteric moments on Kate Bush’s ARIEL.
In this new interview with The Mouth Magazine, Lisa discusses the song and also reveals a little about TWO RAVENS, her moving meditation on Alzheimer’s Disease. She explains why there has been a six year gap between albums, and hints at future plans…

IT’S BEEN SIX YEARS SINCE YOUR DEBUT ALBUM WAS RELEASED… WAS THE WARM RECEPTION WILD AND UNDAUNTED RECEIVED SOMETHING OF A FACTOR IN THE LENGTH OF TIME BEFORE HIDDEN SEAM?
Well, yes and no. Sure, I think there can be a feeling of trying to live up to something – but eventually you have to forget that and move on. I find if I put too much attention on the outside – what I think other people think I should be doing – it can be debilitating and hinder artistically… I felt extremely lucky and privileged WILD AND UNDAUNTED received such a positive reaction. In all honesty, it really did take me by surprise – it was really amazing. It lead to a very busy and enjoyable time touring and being invited to take part in some fantastic musical adventures. But I felt I didn’t want to just throw out another album quickly for the sake of it – so it was right after that point to take some time… I also wanted to spend some time with my daughter and my family.

I WONDERED IF WILD AND UNDAUNTED WAS A ‘FLAG IN THE SAND’, REALLY? LOOKING BACK, IT FEELS LIKE A DELIBERATE POINT FROM WHICH YOU STRETCH YOURSELF OUTWARDS… YOUR SOUND HAS DEFINITELY SHIFTED…
It’s interesting that you think my sound has shifted… I think that’s to be expected, right? Yes, it really did feel like a stake in the ground. It’s a reference point, definitely… From the outset I did consciously want to move on for the second album, creatively. I wanted to allow my writing free rein and not impose too much in terms of form. I also wanted to push my voice a little in areas that, perhaps, with traditional material I might have felt more restricted…

AROUND THE TIME OF WILD AND UNDAUNTED, WHAT WERE YOUR AMBITIONS FOR YOUR MUSIC?
I’d always loved singing and I always knew I wanted to sing and play music – but it took me some time to gain confidence. Really, it was when I first met Gerry Diver that I started recording. He was already a professional recording artist by that point and he’d toured all over the world. I had very strong ideas about my approach, how I wanted many of the tracks to sound on that first album. For instance, I knew I wanted a real Morris music beat on the title track and something more witchy about the song BITTER WITHY. I was thinking a lot about textures and atmospheres but, in all honesty, in large part the sound was due to Gerry’s input as producer and instrumentalist. It really was great that the album was received so well – and I thank everyone who worked on it for that, too.

WHAT, OR WHO, WERE YOUR MAJOR MUSICAL INFLUENCES? FAMILY?
Yes, my mother’s family are all musical. They all played piano and danced, so it was very natural for me to do that. I played a lot at primary school. I was lucky enough to go to a school where the headmaster had a real ambition and drive to get the children playing instruments and singing and performing – we had a school orchestra and a school choir. I had violin lessons, guitar lessons. I also played at secondary school but kind of fizzled out as a teenager – the classical violin lessons became more and more tedious. 

… SO YOU HAD LESSONS AT SCHOOL, BUT WHAT WERE YOUR FIRST EXPERIENCES OF PLAYING OUTSIDE OF THAT LEARNING ENVIRONMENT LIKE?
To be honest, as a young child I never really felt as though I was in a learning environment. I always enjoyed playing music – violin, guitar, singing. I never felt like I had to practice. I just enjoyed playing, which I think is probably the ideal way to learn anything. I’m sure that must be due in large part to the teacher and the teaching style because, as I said, it did get tedious as I got older. Different teacher and different circumstances maybe?

HOW DID YOU GET INTO FOLK MUSIC?
I’d stopped playing for a while, but I was always passionate about pop music as a teenager – learning lyrics to songs etc… Later on, I dug the guitar out and started playing it again: electric guitar, jamming with bands… and I started going to a local folk club and sessions. The whole thing started there, really. The first people I came across would’ve been artists like Shirley Collins, Martin Carthy, Anne Briggs, Steeleye Span, Fairport Convention, The Chieftans, Planxty… People whose albums you could find in second hand record shops. They were all major influences in terms of singing and playing for me…

… SO IT MUST HAVE BEEN A THRILL FOR YOU, THEN, TO HAVE MARTIN CARTHY COME AND PLAY ON THE NEW ALBUM ..?
I think Martin Carthy is probably one of my most singular influences, if it’s possible to choose just one. When I first heard his work I think it was probably the first time I actually had a notion that there was a distinct form of folk song that was English – as in not Scottish or Irish – and I was really excited by that. He’s also a lovely lovely man… So generous… Just a lovely guy. It was amazing that he came and played, and I’d absolutely love to work with him again…

WHEN DID YOU START WRITING?
As a late teenager, when I first got back into guitar. I guess that’s when I just went my own way. I always came up with little ditties and was in a band with my friend, Naomi Bedford. We used to write stuff then. I’ve always written bits and pieces – both songs and tunes – but I tended not to finish that many songs…

… AND, FOR YOU, IS WRITING A CEREBRAL OR EMOTIONAL PROCESS?
Both. And in no particular order. Something I’ve really learnt with writing is how much of it is craft, how much of it mostly happens after the original idea or riff or sentence. It’s a very rewarding, but sometimes frustrating, process.

HAVE YOU BEEN ABLE TO STEP BACK FROM YOUR WORK, AND HEAR HIDDEN SEAM AS A LISTENER?
Um, in parts. I think it takes me quite some time to be fully detached enough to be able to listen again, fresh. Some tracks I can do that with sooner than others. But I’m not saying which.

I PARTICULARLY LIKED THE SONG RULER OF THE REST…
Thanks! In my mind, that’s a kind of a lullaby to my daughter. Its a little depressing I suppose – so I don’t sing it to her! It’s like one of those days when you just think “What is the point? I know nothing”… I had an idea that I wanted a kind of Blade Runner atmosphere. Then Gerry came up with the perfect idea of Guzheng, with that gorgeous glissando, slidey sound.

THERE’S ALSO A SONG ABOUT ALZHEIMER’S DISEASE: TWO RAVENS… IT’S VERY MOVING. A STRONG AND EMOTIVE SUBJECT TO WRITE ABOUT…
Yes, it is. A very close relative of mine suffered from Alzheimer’s, and it was harrowing and heartbreaking to witness… Probably a strange thing to write a song about and I didn’t consciously do that. It just, sort of, came out one day as I was at the piano. Although ravens do figure quite a lot in folk song (“around your head they hang, two ravens black”), I wasn’t aware when the line first appeared that two ravens also have a prevalence in Norse mythology. The god Odin had two ravens; Huginn – thought; Muninn – memory, or mind… They’d fly out into the world from his shoulders each day, and bring him back news. He often feared they’d not return, but he feared mostly for Muninn…

SHIPPING SONG FEELS ALMOST LIKE AN ‘INSTALLATION PIECE’… YOU RECOUNT THESE EXOTIC WORDS FROM THE MET OFFICE’S LATE NIGHT SHIPPING FORECAST AGAINST A SORT OF ELECTRONIC AMBIENCE…
There’s no story to the song, its not a narrative. I suppose it’s more like a, sort of, meditation on water physically. It moves through everyone and is such a huge part of life and the planet – and here we all are on this little island cradled by all these waters… For me the idea with the shape of that song was to represent a kind of storm. I had it in my mind to use the Shipping Forecast in some way. When I hear the way the names are read out on it, I have really vivid imagery in my mind of what those places are like – these grand spaces full of blustery weather. Hearing the words on the radio is really hypnotic and very stimulating to the imagination. Just hearing them – South Utsire; Viking – I love the sound of the words, abstractly. I actually love the weather language that the shipping forecast contains as well – squirly showers, cyclonic eight… Fantastic phrases…

… MESMERISING… I GUESS YOU WERE INTENTIONALLY AIMING FOR SOMETHING TO REFLECT THE HYPNOTIC FEEL OF THOSE BROADCASTS?
I didn’t set out for it to be hypnotic so I suppose I can’t take the credit for that… ha! I had it in my mind for some time to use the names and I’d been experimenting with how to get an order for them. I happened to have the list on me one day when Gerry and I were jamming, and he just picked up the autoharp and a beater and started banging it. We really loved the warm, sustained, percussive sound of the hammered autoharp, so just went with it – just banged out a few chords – and that’s how it was born… How many songs are born, I guess?

THERE ARE ALSO LOTS OF REALLY INTERESTING LITTLE SOUNDS WOVEN INTO THE TRACK – AMERICAN MARINE TESTING, SEA CREATURES, SPINNING MOTORS… THE IDEA OF DOING THAT SUGGESTS THAT YOU’RE NOT CONTENT TO WORK ONLY WITHIN TRADITIONAL FRAMES OF REFERENCE FOR FOLK MUSIC…
I don’t know… I think there are quite a few folk bands that have been using sampled noises for some time – Tunng, Memory Band, Oliver Cherer (known as Dollboy), who also did the programming on SHIPPING SONG… They’re all experimenting with that kind of thing… and probably a lot more than I do. There’s also Imagined Village who use lots of programming with traditional songs and musicians. I guess its just a newer technology than people had ready access to in decades gone by – but I don’t personally feel that it’s that far removed. It depends what the word “folk” means I suppose…

DO YOU FIND BEING LABELLED A FOLK ARTIST RESTRICTIVE? LISTENING TO HIDDEN SEAM, I’M NOT SURE IT’S POSSIBLE TO CALL YOU A FOLK ARTIST ANYWAY AS THERE’S SOMETHING PRETTY UNIQUE GOING ON IN THERE ..!
Well, thank you… I suppose from an artistic point of view I just do what I need to do. I can’t really think of myself as a this or that kind of artist. I suppose I do work mostly with acoustic instruments, as I love how different sounds are made on them, and I really have a great love for traditional folk song and music as material to work with. But I also like to make up stuff and hope people will like it. I’m aware, though, that perhaps some will like certain aspects of what I do and not others. That’s fine…

IS IT IMPORTANT TO BE ASSOCIATED WITH A PARTICULAR GENRE? 
Gone are the days when people needed to define themselves according to what music they’re listening to – in a restrictive sense, in my humble opinion… There’s just so much variation now, and the internet has really opened up ideas creatively… I think people are very open these days with music. 

DO YOU LISTEN TO MUCH CONTEMPORARY MUSIC?
We’ve been a bit in between places, home-wise, for a while so I’m a bit lost in terms of listening to stuff. Having a proper place to listen to things has been a bit impossible so, mostly, I listen to the radio in the car. Or just what I come across, or what’s in my laptop. I went through a phase of listening to quite a bit of Arvo Part and watching Noh Theatre clips on Youtube… and I suppose I listen lots to old recordings, really. I go through phases with listening to stuff – sometimes I need to listen to loads of new stuff, and sometimes I need silence…

OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS YOU’VE BEEN INVOLVED WITH YOUR HUSBAND AND MUSICAL PARTNER GERRY DIVER’S SPEECH PROJECT ALBUM, MUSIC IS BASED ON RHYTHMS AND PATTERNS OF SPEECH BY IRISH TRADITIONAL SINGERS… THAT MUST HAVE BEEN QUITE INFLUENTIAL ON YOUR OWN THINKING?
It’s a real milestone piece of work that album, I think. It was amazing to be able to watch it from conception right through to live performance. I learnt so much from watching Gerry and the process he went through, and it was nice to be able to play just a part in something as opposed to being a front person. I loved playing that gig. So exciting…

LISA, WHAT’S NEXT FOR YOU?
I’ll be continuing my EP series A BRANCH OF MAY – chapter two of that next May. I’m hoping to start some solo gigs with that, too. It’s quite a different set up and will, for obvious reasons, be restricted to May. I’d like to support the release of HIDDEN SEAM by gigging it with as full a band as possible over the next year or so. It’s very full sounding, very percussion / drum heavy, and I’d like to represent that live as much as I can. I’m hoping to play festivals next Summer and then do a full on tour in the Autumn. We’ll be gigging it from now on though, really – do come see us if we play near you! Apart from that, I’ve lots of ideas. We’ll see what sticks I guess…

HIDDEN SEAM is available for purchase on CD here, and download, here.